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Oh god, I'm back.
After the 4.1 quests, youll have to remake this one😂
Ok. What if… the Archon war was also a result of forbidden knowledge? I think forbidden knowledge had at least something to do with it. Source: Xiao's teaser.
Zhongli: "As slain gods fester, their vengeful wrath cursed the world, manifesting in infernal forms."
I know 'their vengeful wrath' refers to Archon Residue. But isn't it the same as 'forbidden knowledge', or 'abyssal power'? At least they have much in common. And if their is a root of all problems in Teyvat, it would be the forbidden knowledge for sure.
If Osial had won would he be the lord of Geo or Liyue become the land of Hydro?
We are so back
You know what would be messed up if they followed the hxh story. Teyvet is a small continent and celestia is protectinf it. After it is overthrown, a world 10x bigger will show up. These demons or khare are things that infiltration from the outside world.
Ok, hear me out… we’ll find out more in Natlan. It wouldn’t be very surprising to me if the literal Pyro Archon, whose ideal is WAR, would know about the biggest war in Genshin.
It's hard to control hundreds of gods.
So Celestia decided, "why not let them kill each other first, to make them fewer."
real
I've got to get this out of my head so heres a brain dump of a theory. Similar to how ei had her sister, or ruka was allied with the goddess of flowers and desherat. Furina was the most incapable god of a trio who won the war, the first dieing and the other being sacrificed to gain time on the prophecy, leaving Furina as the hydro archon. If i remember correctly furina is the second to hold the title so either its an Ei being the shadow for the archon deal or the other one disappears at the same time.
Since Teyvat seems to grow elementally powerful creatures naturally, it kinda makes sense that there would be so many demon gods.
As far as the archon war is concerned, each archon rose to power by defeating others, being granted their power and respect (boreas and venti, zhongli and adepti), and protecting humans.
So far, every archon has had their peoples best interests at heart and none of them wish to risk conflict with celestia. They know what happens.
So what better way to bind the 7 strongest elemental beings is there than to hold something they love hostage. Orobashi simply knew too much and Celestia was going to destroy Watatsumi unless he let Ei kill him. He may have been a great serpent but he wasn't a fool. He knew by going all out he would still perish, but his people would be safe.
I suspect celestia killed Makoto during the Khanriah conflict as part of a bigger problem.
Welcome back!
I feel like we will get crazy lore in Natlan
What if teyvat can't sustain too much demon gods, it's like some sort of population control ? The seven dragon sovereign are pure elemental being and the war against the dragons almost destroy the world. What if the remnants of this huge elemental burst from deceased dragons are what made the demon god? Same like archon residue, but because they were dragons & pure elements their remnants just become sentient, unlike the demon gods whose remnant can be tainted with grief and grudge. After the sovereign defeated, there's a LOT of demon gods, influx of elemental energy can also make teyvat unstable, thus MAYBE then the irminsul tree exist to stabilize it by the leylines, AND THEN- while we don't know when did deshret died but my sus is, they see that deshret and the goddess of flower able to team up & actually achive some great stuffs, if other gods follow their steps and be chummy making a divine body of government on earth, another rebeollion against the divine is on the horizon
Before that happen, they curb the many gods by making them fighting each other, I feel it would be like the holy grail war in fate series, they are not only fighting for physical dominion but also ideals, which one gonna win over the heaven, which one determined enough to realize their vision to higher degree. This kinda win win because celestia now have limited threat while the demon gods enjoy their claims. But as time goes by , some the archons realize that this can't go on forever, things changes, venti from the get go want humanity to run the show while he is observing on the sideline, Zhongli follow soon as he feel the age humanity is needed.
Think in the shoes of a dictator and it all make sense.
1.why the war? I think the gods are just natural phenomena, like Azdaha born from nature, and now you world is full of factions that you can't control. What do you do? Design departments that fit your ideal, and have managers.
2. why don't allow quitters. Why give the opportunity of underground organization to form?
3. why allow two or more gods to coexist? If two major factions come to an agreement that they won't cause problems, why should I care?
Thanks for making a video thats Not the newest Archon quest im so tired of seeing that every content creator is just doing that now.
I think the assumption that there was a time when the gods were living peacefully is false. The Archon war is more like the "Warring States" period of Chinese history – a popular theme in Chinese literature and games. It followed on naturally enough from the dissolution of the last dynasty of the (Teyvat spanning) Ancient Civilization. We're told that right after the war with the second throne was ended, there was a period where tribes of humans ruled themselves, and soon after the gods arrived. (This is from one of the desert items talking about before Deshret). The gods were born into this chaotic anarchy and were always at war. They were never at peace except where they could come to some local arrangement, which apparently was rare. The condition for being recognized by Celestia was simple: conquer an entire nation. Deshret never did that because the Dendro gods held the jungle. They may have been allies but neither could qualify as long as neither recognized the other as an overlord.
The false part of that book about Ei starts as soon as she reaches Yashiori, which is before the fictional part about her having to die. Having a god kill off their allies (sister even) is silly and has no good explanation, the more so if they could immediately turn around and resurrect those dead gods without losing the gnosis. Nor does it explain how after the first round archons die their successor need not fight for the gnosis. There is no necessity for a fight that is pushed by Celestia. Celestia wants peace – the fighting always came from the "gods". It's not about finding a worthy god. It's just about getting the gods to stop fighting each other all the time, by recognizing seven winners to settle all disputes. The gnoses aren't the reasons for the wars. This is why the winners don't even seem to care about their prizes. The real prize – and the thing all archons REALLY care about – is that they got to impose their ideal on their humans, and rule as they saw fit to guide their share of humanity.
If you think about it, it's only Dainsleif the god cynic, who says the gods were motivated by a gnosis. His opinion is contradicted by almost every archon.
As the Guyun fragments show all the gods were "good" in the sense of wanting to guide humanity with their ideals.
Gods had the same job as Seelies. To guide humanity. To look after humanity. On behalf of the PO. The Seelies were fired and the gods were given the job. This is why (per Enjou) the gods didn't exist before the fall of the Seelies. At least they didn't exist "as gods". Venti might have been around a long time before he became a god.
Celestia had no need to remove excess gods – they made the gods. They could have got rid of them too. It's true they probably made too many. It's not like Celestia was firing on all cylinders during that time.
Part of the confusion comes from the way the game has deliberately painted Celestia as "bad" and hating humans for a long time before reversing it, starting around the time of Enkanomiya.
When Zhongli "dies" Ningguang seems to shrug and say another god will show up. She's not bothered especially because of Keqing's philosophy that Liyue doesn't need a god. And as far as Celestia's concerned maybe they don't. Peaceful times continue. And that was Celestia's goal.
What if each archon is a hard drive in essence. Each hold a part of memory and history of teyvat. If corruption happens Celestia sends code to wipe that drive. Irsminsul is th3 hard coding that connects each drive to the main part? It's a thought as I like the idea that irsminsul is a super computer. The way it branches and locks data is totally comparable
Updated:
Nevillete confirmed theory that each gnosis contains power of Dargons extracted by Primordial One.
Upadated 2: Dragon will be limited with its power, unless Archon with the same power perished, or refuse to use and keep gnosis for itself
Please, talk slower.
For us non native english, its difficult to keep up.
I have to backtrack in the vídeo often
“I hope there are no important lore drops”
I have bad news for you Aster.
10:20 wasnt rex lapis chilling in celestia before the right of descension? and he said celestia wasnt that great?
Come to think of it, that slight discouragement kind of hits the same tone as "dont seek the master of the four shades" line from post the second who came
I expect celestia is mostly empty/ruined, duno what gives me that hunch except for the games intro screen being a bit broken up.
so venti was a seelie right?
i sware somewhere early-mid liuye someone (npc) mentioned rex lapis was a geo slime but that could totally be me being crazy, i was barely getting to dragonspine at the time and didnt know how deep the lore would go
Further, everything must keep irmansul in mind, its entirely possible that whatever reason there was for the archon war is a LIE covered up by irmansul tampering. Even zhongli wouldnt be able to recal, unless its stored in the memory of dust or something.
AND were were we? The siblings, including us, traveled through tehyvat COMPLETELY once before, and that memory has been erased, ergo OUR spot in ages past is deleted.
Our sibling made a SECOND journey 500 years ago. so WE existed during this archon war, or before depending on how long we were in the box.
Does the fatui know this when they say were the xth descender? or have we been counted twice?
I suspect the reason is much simpler:
An advanced nation appears somewhere where it has no business being, looks at the poor old folk that had been living there perfectly fine on their own, and says "let's arbitrarily divide these guys into several regions with no regard to ethnical, cultural or historical identity, install puppet governments and make them fight each other. We give them weapons (visions/gnosis) and while they're tearing at each others throats, we take all their resources, project our power and convince them that they are worthless without our support" – and they just make every conflict drag for as long as possible to maximize profit.
I guess there is a possibilty that Celestia didnt actually provoke a war. Maybe it is a sort of metaphor for "there were too many gods and eventually they started clashing for land and resources" since for me it seems that "Archon War" is sorta like a real world term "Fall of Rome" where it is not one conflict, but a bajilion of battles, wars, clashes and skirmishes lumped together under one catch all term
I remember it being written somewhere that king deshret refused a gnosis from celestia while other gods were still alive, so they must've had other criterias too other than winning
I know genshin is your main thing, but i’d really love to hear your takes on HSR lore.
In his Forbidden Knowledge-afflicted rantings in the Staff of the Scarlet Sands lore tab, King Deshret says that "The cycle of seven must be removed, because the secret narrative will be blocked." That makes me think that at least part of the function of the Seven Archons or Sovereigns is to keep Forbidden Knowledge, or the Abyss more generally, from leaking into the world. Wonder if that has anything to do with current happenings in Fontaine…
4.1 – there's a big lore drop
4.1 Spoilers
Arlecchino speculate that Neuvi is the Hydro Archon, her statement prompted Paimon to ask Neuvi, within ear shot of a garde, if this was true, Neuvi didnt answer this instead he express his grief after relating rain with hydro dragon sadness and voila it rain. The Traveler and Paimon put two and two together and summarize that Neuvi is the sovereign of water, which they quickly ask, again within earshot of a garde. Neuvi didnt actually say yes at least not like he is stating the word yes, but his wording at least can be summarize as so, Paimon afterward ask why doesnt he just use his dragon power to seal the Primordial Water in absoluteness, in which Neuvi respond none of the incarnation of the sovereigns is as powerful as their precursors previously and this is due to the fact the gnosis have taken away their powers and he suggest that any of the incarnations strength can only be restore to at least more powerful level if the archons relent their gnosis which would be a disaster for the humans under them, like socially revolt and all of that. So Neuvi statement point that those gnosis hold the sovereigns powers at least, maybe the process of extracting them only completed at the beginning of the Archon War. Again this whole statement was made within earshot of a garde at the garden in front of the theater none the less, let hope someone dont get any ideas on how to desperately solve the prophecy…
Mare jivari lore please
This is my boneheaded theory
Pre-Archon war, we can assume that all gods are living harmoniously together with other gods (just like in sumeru where 3 gods exists to govern the land) but when Celestia came out they decided to launch a war-game between archon vs archon (to obviously shave down the number of gods).
Why the Celestia do it? Because they are simply afraid of the presence of many gods. They also think that they will never conquer teyvat if there are so many gods around.
To simply put, Celestia want to conquer teyvat but they want to trim down other gods so they can easily manage and to lessen the likelihood of retaliation from other gods.
My theory is that the gnosis contain the power of the elements from each sovereign and Celestia HAD to give the gnoses to the fittest to may be keep the dragons from awakening or reincarnating (from 4.1 Archon Quest)
Also, how did the war stop, was it counted till seven and coincidentally found each from an element or the let the same elemnt gods fight each other and found a victor from each element?
the thinks with gods being of concepts make me think of aeons from star rail