Genshin Impact developers from Hoyoverse was recently interviewed by Gamespot regarding endgame content and what to look forward to after Genshin Impact 3.1. In the interview, the developers discussed their perspective on adding combat content like Spiral Abyss. This was very disappointing to a part of the Genshin Impact community. This video shares my thoughts and perspective about the topic. #GenshinImpact #Hoyoverse
Link to the article: https://www.gamespot.com/articles/genshin-impact-developers-talk-endgame-content-and-welcoming-newcomers/1100-6507942/
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I think Zajef (and you) summed it up well that it's immediately obvious Hoyoverse's answer was disingenuous.
Gacha games are successful because the model relies on giving players anxiety in the form of FOMO, encouraging them to spend money on the game, after giving just enough to get you addicted to the gambling system. Therefore, it's unreasonable to believe in any circumstance that they actually have "preventing player anxiety" in their business's priorities.
The unfortunate truth is that we may never know the real reason Hoyoverse doesn't have plans for such content, although we have tons of evidence that they're capable of it.
Just deleted the game after one year of non-F2P. Enought contempt and hypocrisis from Hoyoverse, gamers are not money slaves. Fuck resin, fuck artefacts and fuck stats / substats ; it's anyway useless to build a character since you will just walk around the map, kill squishy mobs and watch anime sorry dialogue for hours.
As a lore nerd and a casual player who also enjoys combat realted content, I must say this is such an stupid desicion by Hoyoverse. It has become a yearly tradition to piss off the community during anniversary no matter what.
An endgame content is much needed for this game's longevity and after this interview…players will surely feel despair as their months and years of hard work of grinding artifacts, talents, building team and characters was nothing but worthless and waste of money.
Genshin's combat system is so beautifully created, with all those intricate details, elemental reactions and gameplay mechanics. Aside from the story, exploration, music, this combat system is also a part of this game makes it even more immersive. It even gave birth to sub genre of players who solely focus on combat related gameplay, team bilding and theory crafting! So why make such a details combat mechanism if you ment this game to be solely for story and exploration?
Yes there are tons of casual players who don't like to do spiral abyss and combat stuff, but adding a endgame challenge like abyss won't make them feel left out bcz most casuals don't even try spiral abyss if it's too hard for them (and also that 600 primos won't get you anything really) so adding an combat focused event with little to no reward, bounties, dungeon, raids with co-op and difficulty settings, it won't ever induce FOMO to casual players because it's permanent so if can do it they will try, if not leave it. Just like abyss, you play for fun and dps check.
All these 'anxiety' stuff they said is so bs like bish I got 7 years worth of anxiety during the perilous trail last cutscene when Xiao was about to die than not able to beat a dendro chiken on floor 12 💀
of course Mihoyo has all the stats ,info of what their players do most or like the most ,ppl who just play Genshin impact for the spiral abbys sure they are a 10% of the players base "building character Is not necessary for the spiral abbys, u can try ur damage by exploring, killing on the way"
Just give us world lvl increase, it'll give us more resin efficiency make the content harder/more fulfilling for the players who have reached that point, overworld is too easy
Most event i end up rushing when they are about tpo end, beacuse im almost always busy and there is nothing to enjoy on them, FOMO is horrible in this game, and content that is always going to be there would be good to have some fun on free time.
and also the time gate on some event its horrible and if i get to have time to play them early i wont be able to complete them , so im forced to do the rest of the event at teh event or later all together and stressed.
Genshin Trully is the game of FOMO in its maximum capacity.
and also about the end game they are adding i wont play it since im not a fan of card games, it will only be a a gamemode to collect cards for me, and that is not so fun.
Honestly, even just an optional WL9 would be good enough for me as far as end game content goes. Im at a point where i can kill basically everything in the overworld in a single rotation.
running around sumeru with candace and meme teams is actually fun cause not everything dies in one hit. And i can actually enjoy the combat.
They just need to cap the amount of primos to 600 and give us more ways to obtain them with different endgame combat options. The anxiety comes from people's fomo on primos and they said it themselves not everybody is interested in musk reef.
Kingdom of heroes has similiar system that has 100 floors
the perilous trail combat event was very fun and wish they made that permanent for the underground casm as there is no other reason to go there anymore, unless you need mats from the serpent ruin that is
TenTen covered it really well. Basically what he discovered is that if players can't clear content they feel anxious in a similar way to when you are bad at studies compared to the rest of your peers. So there is a distant part of community that will lose interest in the game if there will be too much content they can't clear. So the reason is valid from a business perspective for Hoyoverse, but it's not fair to the players who want more challenging combat-focused events
I 💯% agree with you Sevy. The reason why I pulled for Xiao last Lantern Rite Festival is because of the Hard Combat Contents that I can't complete with my Childe and his Vaporize team. I really hope that the people who made that article made a mistake and misundertood the Devs or that the Devs are just testing the fans if this will make the 1st Anniversay Backlash repeat again.😑😔☹
Such bs. Events and primos and dailies are far bigger sources of anxiety than abyss
No endgame? Ok!
But don’t expect me to pull on the new banners anymore…
Since there won’t be new content in which to use them, you don’t need them!
Another greedy gaming company that only cares about money,
they tell you that content makes you anxious and then give you the option to pull for constellation and refinements, what a sick joke.
The gaming industry needs to die and be rebuilt from scratch.
Serenitea pot could become a player build battle arena. The mechanics to capture creatures are there just apply it to monsters and we've had events where we configure the battle to make it harder. You co op it and Mario maker mini game shows you can share domain builds. It'll be on the player to choose to build this grind/capture monsters (content) Its time to take the Serenity outta the teapot.
Thanks for letting me know that I will have no place to play my well-built favorite characters. Characters that I’ve spent time and soul making better day by day. Thank you for devaluating my gaming experience, and saying that it’s invalid.
No no. We are all interested in musk reef. Musk reef = more primos. So i dont see why we all not interested in it. In my opinion, the reason i dont do was because im lazy. I can 36 star in 10 min. But i am too lazy to do it.
AR 60 here, playing since first Klee banner, former MMO & shooter looter gamer.
22:50 up to 23:45, that is the powercreep problem here where Devs and mainly meta aka MMO players polarize. Under a powercreep situation, if you try to get stronger characters, this is filter out old ones and just mid ones (old and new). Doing the content with just a few characters is what the meta players build: filtering out the way of doing things easier and disregarding like f.e. Thomas variations. So in a sense, there is still a kind of powercreep already in the game, but nourished mostly by the players which are used to such content from elsewhere – and in some way by the Devs, because the earliest supporters are somewhat too strong in that sense, like you said in earlier vids.
I see it the same as your interpretation here with the FOMO topic, the weird reasoning of them etc., but the powercreep factor is a state of a game, a problem for many games in their entire existence and can cut a game's lifetime short – especially in all the online loot & MMO games. If not properly made, you have the WOW powercreep problem where your arsenal before the newest update can become useless. That kills WOW slowly.
This powercreep mindset is coming from MMO communities, hence why I compared meta with MMO – because everything they ask for is striving there.
Also, your frustration with the artefacts is from the type of powercreep endgame the meta players want to go, but just made somewhat controllable/easier and longer to enjoy. The farming factor to wait for the one legendary item is the MMO habit and sole farming factor. We have that with substats.
Also, if the Devs would allow the common endgame chasing with powercreep, the problem will appear in some game updates again after just presenting another abyss. It will be exactly then when the meta players can easely breeze through the new one – and the circle continues: "it's boring", wanting another new kind of endgame, getting one, building up in few weeks strategies, getting through it with breeze, telling it's boring etc. .
The main problem for the Devs is that I think the Abyss has a long time adapted to them, while trying to fight further powercreep at the same time. They try to avoid real powercreep, because in a gatcha game this tends to bring up cries for lawsuits like in the past some fractions did with first version of Zhongli because he was too weak as an archon. It's just that their anti-powercreep strategy didn't really work, because the variation of characters used in Abyss is still very thin.
So I think the devs are trying to get some other type of core game instead now as an avoiding strategy.
It's just that they sadly disregarding any combat endgame without powercreep and I'm asking myself why. Is it not possible with the existing online game systems or are the communities just too used to powercreep to get us into a powercreep-less one?
(PS: Funny that you say it's the best combat system how it is (which I agree), because I read from the meta side f.e. that "Genshin's combat system is complex, but not deep" and therefore not the best system, but it can get better.)
I'd be very anxious and stressed if there's more combat based endgame content, since I'm a very busy person. Imagine having a very time consuming job, plus a very long commute, I only have a few hours for myself and could only play around an hour a day. I have a lot of content to comb through with so little time. I can be classified as a casual gamer but I'm also a type of gamer who wants to get good and 36 star the abyss. I can now 36 star the abyss but it takes all of my free time. So making another combat based endgame would stress me and make me anxious since I would like to "beat" it but I can't since I don't have the time. It may seem rambly but if you only have an hour of game time per day maybe you would understand.
Congrats Ms. Sevy, your contents will be usefull for them that use their charactee to get photo some animals, catching some animals and jumping on mushrooms
Sevy!! Here me out, Hoyoverse will eventually add them 🥲but just not any time soon, were not half in into the Genshin story so it doesn't make sense for them to add them this early. when we will be more deep into the game story archon quest, To get more new players in future, they will eventually add those. cuz they do have access to do so for Example in Honkai impact we have weekly Raids, The false god Otto etc. My Conclusion Mihoyo knows their Player base & adding those endgame stuff this early will cause diminishing return for future Content for them to use to attract New Players. What about finding my Brother? is endgame more important then to find Aether ? Lumine is Disappointed 😔
honestly this just reinforces my opinion that genshin is their cash grab to fund honkai impact 3rd. i started playing honkai recently and the difference is astounding. there's so much care put into it compared to genshin. characters, story, combat, animation, everything– is mostly extremely well designed. their endgame content is sufficiently challenging (and there's many forms of it). you can get "fragments" of non-limited banner characters not just from the gacha but from f2p currency, allowing you to grind for it and choose which ones you want. characters that are power crept are often reworked using "augment cores" that can be activated to change their kit. artifacts (stigmata) can be rerolled easily. the list goes on.
they know how to do endgame and grinding properly. they are choosing not to because they see genshin as a short term cash grab and want to cater to new players and collectors, not long term players.
Also think resin shouldn't be the only currency players have to power up characters…. we literally use resin for EVERYTHING!
Things that give me ¨ MASS GRIEF ¨are resin, bad events.
People who have higher expectations are spending money on the game and that's why they expect too much.Stop spending money stop caring about it
My most important dealbreaker with Genshin was killing La Signora, I worked so fcking hard during 2020 and 2021, bought a new phone, I got 1322, ……….1322 fcking wishes to get her C6 and her weapon for what, for 2.1 to drop and destroy all my hopes. So now I'm f2p WITH NO PURPOSE TO PLAY THIS GAME ANYMORE OTHER THAN PLAY THE STORY…..A LONG ASSSS BORING STORY, FCKING ARANARA B*TCH. With no endgame now its time to move on to other games like ToF ….who am I kidding, I'm also going back to grind lp in League of Toxic afk troll….sorry League of Leguends. At least is more interesting than the waste of potencial Genshin is.
Constellation, Weapon refining are just a "paid to flex" in abyss for "casual / fat dolphin / thin whale"
I come from a long line of MMORPGs and Genshin Impact was the only gacha game to hold my interest. The constant struggle for fresh endgame is something that every online game struggles with. For Final Fantasy XIV we've had basically the same endgame just different paint, for a solid decade ( I played that game for about 6 yrs). The only difference in those fights is the name and difficulty and that's it (in the form of a boss arena with varying mechanics). All other forms of endgame is just whatever you decide to call endgame and deal with it lol.
Genshin Impact would definitely end up going down that exact same route. People would be excited, beat it, then complain there's not enough endgame once again. It doesn't matter how hard or how much they add, it will just cause the game to go down the same endless spiral. That being said…
Now, I'm not saying I'm against them adding in endgame content or just new permanent content overall. But I am saying that I think I can see exactly where the devs are coming from just based on gamers and their response to endgame content in other games. Afterall, Hoyoverse advertises itself as gaming, anime lovers like us lol.
Since the combat events they add in is a temporary thing, in a way, it stays new and fresh. If it's popular enough and they wanted to use these events as a tactic to excite people, they can bring it back. And maybe even add something more to it the next time around. But if they were permanent, how fast do you think peeps would get bored of it?
The form of endgame this game needs, as a guess, is something that is fun (both casual and core gamers) and not just about raw power. Maybe something that gimps your damage randomly or suddenly only one element works until you solve a mini puzzle. I don't think stuff like raids, tower defense or just simply flipping a switch to give bosses/enemies more damage, HP and defense will cut it. Players would just simply find a way to over power anything simple like that and be back to boredom.
Perhaps Hoyoverse is well aware they can't just add in simple increase of difficulty and instead need a lot more for it to stay relevant long-term. This is all just my guess and opinion of course but this game isn't exactly a simple one even with all the memes/haters claiming it is.
I think the biggest issue with everyone being upset about this article is that people are taking "no new spiral abyss" as "no new combat endgame" and thats not what hyv has said.
Before I start, the context for my opinions: Im ar 59, been playing since 1.4. And I only 36 starred abyss for the first time 2 days ago.
Spiral abyss is a very specific type of combat style. Everyones suggestions for new combat games arent spiral abyss, theyre labrynth warriors, or other "survive as long as possible" type challenges, or our point gathering styled events. which is a far different feel to spiral abyss. Abyss is regularly described as a "dps check" it's "fight this thing as fast as possible", and several abyss rotations have been extremely difficult without the right high dps units.
I also think people are overreacting to "no new endgame being planned right now", we're about to get new endgame in 3.3. They dont have to already be planning the next wave of it. We do not /need/ an endless cycle of new end game, at that point theyre just fancy events. And things take awhile to plan. For all we know they do have some ideas bouncing around, but nothing solid enough to announce in an interview.
And I think right now we should get a fun endgame that isnt combat focussed for the players that despise spiral abyss (points at myself). The teapot imo is hardly endgame, its tossed together because they already have the assets available so why not let us play around with them in a little sandbox.
Which is why other endgame like the tcg is going to be so important, something a lot more accessable and hopefully less aggrivating for players who dislike how abyss is set up, and far more fun for those who dont care about the teapot. (And this is also why I think a future combat endgame would be survival focussed, as it is a less stressful type of combat with healers and shields available, and is something that genuinely tests your skills every time, unlike current abyss which is commonly a "how good are your artifacts"/"how deep is your wallet" style of dps check. (imo ofc) Also an endless survival "wave after wave" type end game, or even event, just sounds so damn fun.)
And offhandedly, on the resin cap issue: I dont see an issue in the current cap (tho I'd prefer a cap of 180 rather than 160, not changing the refresh rate). I think the better resin solution would be to make fragile resin easier to obtain. The higher the resin cap, the more people will worry about condensing. Fragiles however can be held for as long as you need, waiting to be spent when you have a whole afternoon to build a new character.
Genshin is designed to only ask 30-45 minutes out of you a day (coms and resin), increasing the resin cap increases that time of daily play, and some people just wont have the time to deal with it all (and no condensed doesnt always help, if say youre busy for a whole week and cant play that long during it). Meanwhile none of those issues exist with fragiles because theyre only used when you have the time for them. I would love to see fragiles be event rewards, or even spiral abyss rewards, or be rare drops in weekly bosses.
Another possible solution would be to remove the condensed cap, but I see it being far less likely than just making fragiles more readily available.
They just said that they don't have a plan for another spiral abyss type experience.
Simple way to say it, mihoyo.. spiral abyss is getting boring because its repetitive, the boss are new but its the same format for whole 2 years. You can design amazing place like dragonspine, enkanomiya and the chasm which players probably already forgot, yet still didn't do any revision to the musk reef.
I've been playing this game for 2 years now and what really pushes me to play the game the most other than the archon quests is the combat mechanics of Genshin.
It's just really disappointing to hear about the comment of "excessive anxiety" for endgame combat-based permanent content. Yes not all players are interested in Musk Reef (Spiral Abyss) but it doesn't make sense (to me at least) that they would worry about players having "excessive anxiety" for additional endgame combat-based permanent content that is OPTIONAL. The Spiral Abyss itself is optional and it resets bi-weekly.
In my opinion, if there's any content currently in the game that could give "excessive anxiety" to the players, it would be wishing on the limited and standard banners as well as the leveling up and farming of artifacts.
This is where ill disagree with you and unsubscribe from your drama. Im playing Genshin since the game was released and I experienced none of whatever you tackled here. Bye.
I just ask my self , what's for C6 and R5 (5*) for????? Mihoyo pocket and for earn money and get rich…… horror
Its quite possible that a lot of ppl do not even do the abyss. Or, like me do a run and thats it, with the idea of (getting this annoying thing over with). Hoyoverse knows how many ppl actually play the abyss and its possible that making even more difficult combat they would alienate a lot of ppl.
As someone who have cleared the spiral abyss for quite some time now, I agree with the arguments/opinions laid by Sevy. I still do enjoy the game, but there were times when I would ask myself why I'm still playing this game when my goal of clearing the spiral abyss was already achieved. I do love the deep lore of genshin, but what made me stick to the game was the rich combat system Sevy mentioned. I actually made a second account just to experience again raising characters and gain satisfaction again as they get stronger for them to be spiral-abyss-ready..
For me the statement about "anxiety" was plain stupid. YOU KNOW WHAT'S MAKING ME REAL ANXIOUS? IT'S THE REALITY THAT MY GENSHIN FRIENDS ARE ONE BY ONE DECIDING TO STOP PLAYING BECAUSE THE GAME IS GETTING BORING FOR THEM. I DON'T WANT THE DAY WILL COME WHEN I'M THE ONLY ONE LEFT PLAYING.
Most of my friends who are left playing were casual gamers who just like pulling for new characters and don't care about the spiral abyss. I know there are a lot of ways to enjoy the game, but I think the enjoyment of these casual players is what Hoyoverse is focusing on because it's where the money is.
With all of these being said, my idea of an additional endgame content is something that me and my genshin friends can all enjoy again. I don't have an exact idea of how it should be, but I hope it should be equally fun and challenging.
Looking at Kokomi while listening to an extremely valid statement you make about endgame content is very troublesome atm..😑
Allot of times I forget to finish the spiral abyss as I find it boring. While I miss the more dungeon types of events we had in Inazuma. Killing bosses(/end challenges) after completed some hallways (build like a maze) with monsters felt so much more satisfying.
As someone who has worked in development, has a huge college history of psychology and of writing and works as an engineer…. Changes to games like this seem very simple and streamlined to me. I often look at something, play a game for a bit, or just talk to someone about issues and can rapidly see and resolve the problem (or at least come up with ideas to start the process of criticism and resolution)
In the case of genshin impact, after the first 4-05 months I had figured the issues and how to resolve them. I then took another 2 months beating my head against a wall trying to figure out why if I had come up with them, a random guy on the internet, how a multi million dollar company hadn't. Then I realized they had, and truly did not care. That costs money, the game works for their CA audience, and the western players make up such a small portion of their profits our voice is but an annoyance to them.
The end game fixes are simple, they would take no more than a half hour a week extra to complete and for those outside China with hours to spare that becomes heaps of fun. But sadly the chinese player base dictates a large majority of what happens in game and that is the biggest thing western players must realize and then start to actually voice opinion in why that is not okay or stop spending all together and let Hoyoverse reap what they sew and lose profits. The sooner the company loses profits too the sooner the stocks drop, the development gets cuts and eventually the company either smartens up, fails, or you get precious time and worrying back.
why did they made such an amazing reaction system and do nothing to try it out thing die in overworld so fast you cant even do a full setup and abyss is just 15min every 14days.
It took me 1yr and a hell lot of skill to finally beat abyss.. as a f2p or low spender the grinding of artifacts is real pain, so once you invested so much time and money to finally reach that level they knows you are not gonna go anywhere no matter how much content they give or not. also in that 1yr of lifespan they milked so much from you that it doesn't matter if you leave.
what a way for devs to address this coming from a whole rpg gacha game. anxiety already induces unto players from either winning or losing 50/50s on banners or farming artifacts in domains 🥴 the game has gained its recognition for it's unique gameplay graphics and story. mihoyo just need to LISTEN to their playerbase. apprarantly all those monthly surveys asking for diluc buffs and ningguang auto target fix are for nothing 💀
I wasted 3 weeks of resin for 1 decent new artifact for my Lisa… And my artifacts are FAR from optimal and still i only get junk
Hi Sevy, I too have been reading the discussions on this topic since yesterday and I want to give my point of view. English is not my forte, in case I write something that is not well understood.
When they say that players can feel stress, I think they are referring exclusively to FOMO, not necessarily to the fact that the content is combat-type (although I personally do feel it in the abyss, oof). I clarify this because the following revolves around that idea.
I believe that Hoyo is following a strategy of maintaining a higher number of active players (and income) even if it seems otherwise. No one knows their playerbase better than they do and I think the polls are telling them that more permanent content could drive that number down.
I'm going to use myself as an example. During the week it is really difficult to dedicate more than 30-45 minutes a day without subtracting hours of sleep. Work/commute, house chores, etc. make it really difficult. Every time I talk to a friend about Genshin, I realize that one of the things I value most is being able to stay up to date with limited time I have. I feel lucky, some of my friends have left the game because they couldn't even keep up with the events. The accumulated frustration makes them lose the desire to play, even though they love it.
I'm not sure what percentage of players will be in a similar situation, but I imagine that percentage is also the ones who spend the most money in the game on average. I suppose this simply due to the fact that having a salary gives you the possibility to spend, at least to some extent.
As a player with limited time I think it wouldn't bother me if the game had more content, but I've also been playing (in general) for many years and I know that when you don't get to do all the content repeatedly, you end up feeling a slight frustration that grows over time and it makes you to leave the game. I remember my years of WoW fondly but ultimately quit for this very reason.
Right now in Genshin I feel like a perfect balance of effort/time for people in my situation, but at the same time I understand players who have a lot more time and want to make the most of it. In this sense, I think Hoyo is trying to find the best balance for his earnings. Nothing more.
A final thought. I think if I had more time to play I wouldn't want much more endgame content in Genshin either, maybe just a little more. I probably would prefer to spend that time on other leisure activities or even try other games. Sometimes I feel like I'm burning out a game I love just by spending too much time on it.
I guess these issues are complicated the bigger your playerbase is. It is impossible to keep everyone happy. Surely what I like the most about Genshin is exploration and as long as they don't take it away from me I'll be happy 🙂
Anxiety? Clearly they've never lost a 50/50 or rolled useless artifacts
I’m so glad there’s backlash about this from a lot of content creators bc fr it’s so annoying that we can’t use our decked out characters/ try out teams seriously other than abyss (which is already fine or even easy for many). They could have at least given a better response, this interview or qna whatever was a joke and disappointing af. They better respond again after this